Sunday, June 15, 2014

In the Court of Law and the Court of Life




One of the most important traits of a proper criminal profiler is objectivity; to view the evidence without subjectivity or without allowing emotions or personal gain to cloud one's determinations. These are also the most important traits of a detective, a judge and a jury, the media and for anyone analyzing any issue. In reality, often these traits are limited or missing, both in professionals and layperson. And, because this is true, things don't always work out in life in a just and honorable manner. Let's see how this plays out in the McCann case.

Let's start with citizens, those people who make up a town or a state or a country. The first problem with citizens addressing any issue is ignorance. If you asked a good portion of people about the McCann case, they either wouldn't know a thing about it or they would say something like, "Isn't that the little girl Scotland Yard is looking for?" or maybe, "Isn't that the little girl that got kidnapped because the parents were out drinking?" Most people don't even pay much attention to the news and those that do, go with what the media is telling them and no further. They aren't spending hours delving into the matter via Facebook and Twitter and blogs.

The second issue is apathy. If the citizen deems the issue to be of little importance to his life, he may simply ignore it. I can guarantee you that the majority of citizens in the US, the UK, and even Portugal really could give a damn about the McCann case. Likely, the strongest interest lies with the citizens of Praia da Luz who just don't like the bad name town got concerning crime because that affects their business. I am sure some citizens of the UK are pissed that taxpayer money is being spent on what seems a fruitless endeavor by Scotland Yard, but I wouldn't be surprised that quite a few will simply say that the money is well spent if they can find Maddie and bring closure to those poor  suffering parents. It is probably a small portion of citizens who find the matter important enough to get bent out of shape about.

The media has about zero objectivity any more because if "it bleeds, it leads." It's about the money, as  much as can be gotten through ratings and readership. There are exceptions to this rule, but then we see agendas, on the left and on the right, and for special interest groups. Sometimes the truth comes out, especially in smaller media outlets, but these have difficulty fighting for visibility against the big guys. Sometimes when a questionable story comes out, I have to google to the 20th or 30th page to hit upon true facts about the matter and how many people do you think google that far down? Hence, the importance of getting high on the search engines and that costs money. Right now the media, for either reasons of money or politics, is squarely in the McCann camp.

Citizens can make a difference, I am not saying that they can't. I am just saying that it takes one hell of an issue to cause such an uprising that it gets traction and the protest has to gain incredible legs to threaten the people that wield tremendous power and control. And, sometimes, even then, what is perceived to be a victory is really one power faction getting behind a particular group to take down the other power faction. Sometimes even bad people do good things for society when it benefits them to do so. I was hoping maybe this was the case when Scotland Yard first got hold of this case, that maybe the political winds had changed and now the McCanns would be useful pawns for some new political power holders. Sadly, I do not see any evidence of this. But, still, we never know when one of us or a group of us influences someone out there who just might be the key to turning things around. I think that is why we still bother to try because we just never know. Besides, it is still the right thing to do and that alone is a good enough reason.

Detectives are people, too. Most of them really want to catch the bad guys and bring justice to victims and their families. Sometimes they do a fabulous job; sometimes they don't. When they don't, it isn't always because they don't care. They simply may be overworked or poorly trained or their department doesn't support them doing the right (and politically detrimental thing). Sometimes their subjectivity gets in the way or their ego or they get bamboozled by wealthy or well-heeled people who they don't recognize as possibly being criminals. Sometimes, a detective is just not that bright. Sometimes the detectives and the department do everything right, but get screwed by the prosecutor. So, while we want to believe all detectives and police agencies will do a stellar job all of the time, this is simply not reality.

Now, to the courts. Do you know why we have a jury system here in the US? Because we don't trust judges. We realize that they can be bribed, they can be swayed by personal issues, they can allow their egos or emotions get the better of them when they make decisions. There is a reason we have appeal courts and that is to fix the "mistakes" of lower judges (we do this for juries too). Of course, who is to say the lower court judge isn't right and the higher court wrong? Why do you think even the Supreme Court judges can overturn laws made by previous Supreme Court judges? Because all law is just a matter of opinion made by certain judges during certain periods of time. Once it was okay to have slaves and who do you think made those laws? Oh, yeah, infallible judges. All law is a matter of opinion and interpretation. The earlier decision of a lower court judge in the Amaral case had his book taken off the market. Now, some claim he was "inexperienced." No, he just made a determination based on his interpretation of the law (or his biases or his self-interests) and then a higher court judge overturned it based on his interpretation of the law (or his biases or his self-interests).

Monday, the McCanns will show up in court to testify. The present judge will hear their arguments and then, at some point in the probably ridiculous distant future, we will get a judgment. It will not be the judgment of a jury of untrained citizens who have hardly been screened to sit in court and try to understand complicated matters that are completely beyond a good number of them (who each individually might have emotional or other subjective responses to the matter and come to a conclusion that is far from objective). No, it will be the judgment of one person - one - one person who may have been bribed, who may have been swayed by politics, who may have been swayed by the fact one of the best law enforcement agencies in the world, Scotland Yard, appears to be in complete opposition to Gonçalo Amaral - just a lone policeman who went on a tear against a couple of parents of a missing child - a judge who might be swayed by like or dislike for one of the parties, who might simply interpret the law in such a way that people will then say the judge has been bought (by one side or the other). The judge may be perfectly professional and honorable or quite the opposite.

There is simply no way to predict the outcome in Portugal of the civil case of the McCanns and Amaral. I have seen far too many civil cases come to ridiculous conclusions and horrible wrongs perpetuated against individuals who came into court believing that the facts alone would determine the outcome.

In reality, the only ones who usually win hands down in a civil court are the attorneys (of which the judge is one). The two or more attorneys make a hell of a lot of money (and the judge a fine living) and no matter how it all turns out, they may just get together the following weekend on the golf course and have a few rounds of beer afterwards; after all, it is just another workday for them and a well-paid one at that.

In the court of law and the court of life, we can only do what we can in our respective positions as citizens or police detectives or profilers. If we do what is right, regardless of the outcome, we have added some good to the world and, maybe, just maybe, this is what is needed to give the human race the wherewithal to keep on going.

God bless, Gonçalo Amaral, and all of you who have stood for truth. Regardless of the outcome of both the criminal case and the civil case, the simple fact that some human beings will stand up for justice warms the heart and reminds us that there is still good in the world, even though sometimes it doesn't always triumph in the courts.


Criminal Profiler Pat Brown

June 15, 2014

 Cover for 'Profile of the Disappearance of Madeleine McCann' 

Published: July 27, 2011
By Pat Brown
Rating: 1 star1 star1 star1 star1 star
(5.00 based on 5 reviews)


What really happened to Madeleine Beth McCann in Praia da Luz, Portugal in 2007? Was she abducted as the Gerry and Kate have claimed or did something happen to Madeleine on May 3 in the vacation apartment and the incident covered up? Criminal Profiler Pat Brown analyzes the evidence and takes the readers through the steps of profiling, developing a theory that is intriguing and controversial.



134 comments:

Anonymous said...

Good for you Pat. I believe and understand what you are trying to say. We are witnesses to unfair situations all the time especially at work because of internal politics, envy and money. Most people don't want to take sides and stick their necks out for other people and usually the person that is looking for the truth and trying to address some unfair situation ends up in the corner alone.
How many of us have seen this situation time and time again.
In the case of the McCanns, whatever happened to the poor child is now irrevelant. Whatever happens to GA is immaterial. Here we have a case of some very powerful people trying their utmost to pervert justice in the court case McCanns vs Amaral because they need to win and close this case, so that people can get on with their lives. Not our lives not GA's life but other people's lives. David Cameron has the elections ahead of him, Clarence Mitchell wil be running in the local elections,too. The Mcanns can get closure, or continue with their farce and as we really don't know if there was someone else, a VIP perhaps mixed up in all this, he/she could feel comfortable and safe that his/her prescence in PDL in 2007 is no longer an issue. All the rich and powerful people who supported the Mcanns will feel justified in spending all their money supporting the innocent couple and in the UK the kudos for SY will be flying around - at least they tried to find Madeleine. They weren't able to find the body but they found the abductor(s) or whatever they come up with at the end of this sick story. Oh yes, I can see this happening and like you I would like to be proven wrong. I don't like the fact the Mcanns are going to be able to testify in court and I don't like the fact that there is only one judge. Corruption in the legal system is a big issue in Portugal and Spain What else can I say, except good luck to Dr. Amaral. He has stood up for truth at a time when truth is an embarrassment that would best be hidden away. GA does not stand alone because he has thousands of people behind him supporting him (virtually)and hoping upon hope that justice will be meted out.

AnneGuedes said...

Gonçalo Amaral said he trusts justice and he has some reason for that since he won the libel part of the trial.
Here it's different from Common Law, judges are professional magistrates (not nominated) and, if they certainly have to interpret the law, the judiciary and the executive functions are (theoretically) separated powers in order to limit arbitrariness.
In any case GA not only can appeal but he can sue Portugal in Strasbourg (ECHR).
http://www.echr.coe.int/Pages/home.aspx?p=home

Anonymous said...

Thank you Pat for taking the time to respond so expansively on this case. I for one, value your insights and your objectivity borne from vast and varied experience honed over many years. It must be a difficult and arduous journey for GA and I want to add my voice to commend him on standing up for truth, under very difficult and personally challenging circumstances. It must be a lonely and I m sure at times very frustrating and isolating journey he finds himself on, but it is inspiring and so admirable to see his integrity and perseverance shine through. Whatever the outcome of the libel case, hold your head up high knowing you fought for truth and transparency when many ran for the hills covering their own backside!!
It's a confusing and unjust world we live in, but whatever the outcome in the end I m one of the grateful voices fwho ackn owledge what both you Pat and G A.have personally contributed to this serious whitewash case. I add my voice to yours in saying that I believe a terrible injustice has and is being done todate to a gorgeous innocent little girl who you both have worked hard at giving a voice to. God bless you. The world is a better place for truth seekers like you!!

Anonymous said...

I've only happened upon your blog in the last couple of weeks, but have always believed that the McCanns are guilty of neglect at least, probably manslaughter. The visit of SY recently to PDL prompted me to read more into the whole sorry mess. You speak a hell of a lot of sense, Pat.

I can't understand why these parents have not firstly done a lie detector test. If they're so convinced of their innocence, do the test! Then you can shout your innocence from the rooftops!

Also, why haven't they literally been on their hands and knees using every fibre of their being to search for Maddie? God forbid it happened to me, I'd walk the world never sleeping till I found my child, despite any "official" searches.

I also think that SY have been given an end scene to work towards, to close the case. I understand the cancer of deceit and lies which riddle the force.

I'd love to think that there's someone, somewhere near the bottom of this whole stinking pile of BS who does the right thing and speaks out, with some irrefutable evidence, thereby pulling the can from the bottom of the stack, if you see what I mean. I live in hope!

If SY aren't impotent, then they are surely as thick as mince!

Anonymous said...

Pat.

I agree with much of what you say regarding the public in general. It is for this reason that the Justice system has to be anchored with people who are dedicated to the principles it was devised for.

Many of the public are ignorant to the specifics because the propaganda the media have fed them, but without knowing the full detail ..the public know this case is an oddity and something is very wrong....certainly in the UK of what I experienced talking with people about it.

It doesn't matter that people give a dam or not to me, just that the Justice system works in silence uncorrupted.

Most uk citizens don't give a dam about the tax money on these type of cases but expect it to be used fairly for ALL missing children not pseudo cases...that's what gets them angry understandably in my opinion.

money is at the root of most corruption and the media love their slice.....as the saying goes...."don't let the truth get in the way of a good story" sums it up quite beautifully.

I hope citizens can make a difference ..the Law is there for them to protect them...that is fundamental to true democracy.
The enforcers work for the citizens.
The Public is the Master....not the money powerhouses.. though many would question if laws have ever been applied evenly.

"justice for those that can afford it"

Anyway I guess all I am wanting to really add is that as realistic as all the explanations are, they do not begin to address the real damage of when injustice happens and the seeds it can sew.

in respect to the rich attorneys...getting rich through default and misery....all I say is

"calling it your job, don't make it right...boss"

mojo

a4lornhope said...

The McCanns seem hell bent on silencing or breaking anyone whose thoughts dare to verge on what most of us would consider the unthinkable.
As you have said previously Pat, most abductions /harm to children is at the hands of a relative or someone known to the family.
It is beyond belief that no suspected sighting of madeleine has bene accepted by the parents and that they will sue at the dropof a hat.
For me, the thought of going to court to accuse someone else of sullying my reputation when it is clear that my failure is what resulted in the entire saga would always be at the forefront of my mind.
Nothing would be further from my thoughts than going through a libel case when the result might only be moneyin the bank.
It's all absolutely unbelievable. All of it.
My thoughts and prayers are with Goncalo Amaral.

a4lornhope said...

The McCanns seem hell bent on silencing or breaking anyone whose thoughts dare to verge on what most of us would consider the unthinkable.
As you have said previously Pat, most abductions /harm to children is at the hands of a relative or someone known to the family.
It is beyond belief that no suspected sighting of madeleine has bene accepted by the parents and that they will sue at the dropof a hat.
For me, the thought of going to court to accuse someone else of sullying my reputation when it is clear that my failure is what resulted in the entire saga would always be at the forefront of my mind.
Nothing would be further from my thoughts than going through a libel case when the result might only be moneyin the bank.
It's all absolutely unbelievable. All of it.
My thoughts and prayers are with Goncalo Amaral.

Anonymous said...

Pat, the libel judge is a woman....perhaps you can edit the text and then delete this message.

Pat Brown said...

Ah9h 8:59

Thanks for catching that! I fixed it and no need to delete your comment. When I wrote the post, I was so in the mindset of the legal system in general and was using a generic "he" when writing my thoughts.

Anonymous said...

I think that the Internet can be a deceptive medium. It's speed and geographical reach is awesome, but by the same token the 'hits' that it generates can be deceptive. It's easy to fool ourselves into thinking that we represent a groundswell of opinion when perhaps we are no more than a 'village community' circling around an issue that others can either take or leave.

If the campaign were ever to go overland, then it would face the inevitable challenge of appearing to want to harangue two specific people into custody. Like it or not, that is the dilemma faced, and no government is going to allow that to happen (rightly so).

The most that we can do is to urge proper conduct from our police and judicial services, and leave the specifics behind. But this hardly seems adequate. We know what ought to be done - which lines should be pursued - and yet it appears (so far) than no one is willing to follow them. At least not in the UK.

It's easy for detractors to caricature this view as 'conspiracy theory', but the fact that they resort to the caricature just shows their weakness. The McCann saga rapidly swelled into a network of vested interests and opportunists who are now covering their backs. There may be no single, overriding reason for what we have seen. People do conspire of course, and no doubt some pockets of interest have formed deliberate 'pacts'. But in the end, it is sometimes *events* that conspire and that move ahead of us in ways that we might never fully grasp. "Riding the tiger" as has often been said about the McCanns!
Anyway, the teeth of jurisdiction will always be Portuguese not British.

Anonymous said...

http://news.sky.com/story/1283299/mccanns-angry-as-libel-trial-is-delayed-again

Pat have you seen Kate Mccann show her true colours here? I thought she was going to hit Gerry!

MRSFeeX said...

So.. The Mccann did hire their own 'investigaters'
Seems to be a conman in there to. too.
Will he brought to trail to?

The Mccann seems 'to believe' Madeleine is still alive..
Why spending so much time (5year) to bring Amaral down?
Why dont they show 'prove' she is alive..
Then it is clear Amaral was wrong.

No prove of any abduction..
But still the most missing girl wordwide..
Such a fame..
It is a shame..

Anonymous said...


This is significant.

It will be very interesting to see what has happened.

Is it correct that only the McCann's were going to be allowed to give statements in court today ? the reason been that their lawyer had appealed the initial refusal that was given for both sides ...and that Goncalo Amarals lawyer had not appealed?

mojo

Pat Brown said...

Let me address a few things here in response:

1. I do not think the McCanns' response to the court delay was uncalled for. I would have been pissed as hell as well. It is one reason I despise the court system; the tactics permitted should not be. Cases dragging on for years, draining the bank accounts of either plaintiffs or defendants (while enriching the lawyers) as a method to force one side to give in, is wrong and is one reason I believe neither the civil court systems of the world (at least those that allow these kinds of tactics) are not truly about justice.

2. The McCanns obviously likely also used unpleasant tactics via their attorney so I am not saying that Amaral doing so in return is unjustified. Civil cases turn into dirty game playing instead of simply seeking proper settlement.

3. Is this a good tactic by Goncalo if he truly is not having a problem with his attorney or couldn't have informed the court earlier before the McCanns arrived in Portugal? I don't know. IF you believe the McCanns are innocent, I think it makes their case stronger, that this renegade ex-cop is doing all he can to make their lives miserable and suck away their energy simply because he thinks they are guilty (when at this point, Scotland Yard is "proving" he is not justified in thinking do nor should he ever have come to such conclusions from the evidence and the PJ isn't exactly supporting his belief of guilt either).

So, I don't know how the judge will view this because I am not privy to the entire court case nor have I been in the courtroom to see how this is playing out. In the end, I feel it is not unlikely the judge will actually view Goncalo as overzealous in his "vendetta" against the McCanns (especially if she views them as innocent) and find for the McCanns (perhaps with a reduced monetary amount to even out the damage).

Anonymous said...

What we didn't know on June 13 was that GA wouldn't be in court on Monday June 16th to see "McCanns enter the courtroom with their heads held high…" and obviously leaving with their head down with huge feelings of rage, powerless and lack of control!

Maybe the couple need a 12 step recovery, similar with many people use to stop drinking, gambling, lying...

McCanns should admit their powerless in holding the case on their hands, that their life become unmanageable for retaining the whole true about what really has happened on May 3rd afternoon. That would be a good start.

Later they may be able to believe that a Greater Power that themselves, UK Government, the bought media, fake PR's and convenient new friends Could Restore their sanity, perhaps not saving them from misery and public repudiation but from something worse.

Some say that admitting a problem is admitting the faults maybe is about time they also start a moral inventory of their own and consequently making a list of persons they've had harmed and become willing…

As the 12 steps programme is very demanding about make amends, accepting responsibility and understanding what has been wrong with their own life I suggest a STOP here for now.

For the rest of us because we are no saints maybe we should pray out loud to God to remove all our defects of character and protect us from experimenting an afternoon of agony as I believe McCanns had on May 3rd 2007 (although this don't diminuish their fault for the chosen pattern);

Paying for McCanns conversion;

And for last but not the least for GA hope and faith to transcend this last 7 years of probation.

As the program suggests: ONE DAY at a TIME.

guerra said...

There is an article in Correio da Manha entitled "The English police are hiding evidence in the Maddie case". Goncalo Amaral is quoted as saying that the testimony of a British woman, who claims to have seen Mr. McCann walking on the beach at night a few days after the child went missing, has disappeared.

Mr. Amaral is quoted as saying that they tried to retrieve the documents from England and that they simply disappeared.

Mr. Amaral is also quoted as saying that he is convinced the child is dead. He said: "The parents had a key to the church and in that same church a wake was held a month after the child disappeared. He believes that Madeleine's body was placed at the feet of a woman who was to be cremated".

Anonymous said...


My first reaction is I want to know what has happened ?

so I am interested to understand if what I posted earlier is correct.

It is important because we must not forget that the McCann's case at present is technically not valid whilst Madeleine is named on the documents.
So the case is proceeding for what purpose?
If they are been given a non legal platform to give damage statements whilst Goncalo Amaral is gagged from the bench.

well quite frankly that stinks...and I would be P@>@ed off but I guess we will have to wait and see what's going on.

mojo

MRSFeeX said...

Well..
10 days for a new attorney to find is short.

An unproven abduction...
It is still the Thesis from this case they get manage to go on for years.
Even No harm proven, or no prove she is dead..the Mccann claimed.
So no crime in this case?
Only missing?

But the Mccann manage to spend 5 year to get the one to trail who never even met the girl.
Instead of hire some good snifferdogs..

Grr







Im probaly not objective.
But.. It is so wrong..

Pat Brown said...

Guerra,

Goncalo and I have different theories as to how Maddie's body was likely disposed......... I think she was buried t a location like Monte do Jose Mestre where Gerry's phone pinged near. Gonccalo tends to go with a theory where the body cant be found, I think both our theories should be investigated more thoroughly but I don't see that happening.

Anonymous said...


Guerra.

In my opinion its going to get very nasty, possibly even more political. I think Goncalo has reached a point in himself where enough is enough and he is prepared to fight all the way...I believe the fight for Justice is all he has been left with in life.

I hope with all my heart that People get behind Goncalo Amaral.

It is know he will find his true friends.

mojo

Anonymous said...

kate mc cann said outside court we have get someone to mind our children well kate if you Gerry had done this on 3rd may all this farse would not have been going on your only there now because money involved you never even looked for madeline

Anonymous said...

Hello Pat, my feelings about this dilatory measure (if this is what it was) is that, to begin with, the McCann are fighting a man that has been left with not much to lose. If I were G Amaral and were sure of their guilt I would do anything in my power to give them the hardest of times. It would appear this is, indeed, what is happening.
Second, may I remind here that the Court of Appeal already ruled in favour of GA in the preliminary injunction, the MCanns then appealed to the supreme court of justice to have this decision overthrown but the supreme court simply dismissed the application. Since the grounds for preliminary injunctions are, in general, the same that will be put forward in the main proceedings (the one that was delayed today), I am fairly confident that the decision in this main proceedings will ultimately be in line with both the decision of the court of appeal and of the supreme court.
V

Anonymous said...

Wow. Thats the first time I've heard that one. And it is perfection. The priest, or whoever else was party to this, must speak out, finally, please God.

Anonymous said...

Re sky news outside the court room,Can you imagine the phone call from Clarence Mitchell to the Mc Canns,
Clarence-"F&&k me Kate what just happened there"
Kate-"what do you mean Clarence?
Clarence-"well dear you should have kept a dignified silence"
Kate-"what do you mean like?
Clarence-we'll let me be blunt Gerry was angry but you were off the Richter scale "You should have let me come with you"
Kate-"what did I say"
Clarence-"it's not what you said it's how you said it"
"I got the feeling if you had gotten your hands on Amaral the PJ would have another abduction to work on"
Kate"I was so angry though"
Clarence"well dear I'm going to be up all night thinking of some quality BS to repair your imagine,"damage limitation here I come"don't ring me too early tomorrow goodbye"

c

Anonymous said...

I wonder if Goncalo is making a protest of sorts.
The McCanns have been given permission to make statements to the court even though the judge has yet to rule on the question of their legal right to represent Madeleine. That seems ridiculous.
Court sessions and court records are no trivial matter. Either the McCanns have the right to represent their position as legal guardians of Madeleine or they do not. Surely the defendant has a right to a ruling on such a basic principle before the court allows the McCanns to speak.
Amaral has spent months, and no doubt a huge amount of money, trying to obtain documents pertaining to the ward of court issue. Why should he sit idly by whilst their impact becomes diminished by the plaintiffs' presumption of being able to address the court.

How the judge will view it...I've no idea!


Anonymous said...


11.28am

spot on

I cant believe these basic but fundamental points raised keep been skipped over.....they are the foundation of how or if the case progresses...there is supposed to be a process to the proceedings.

something is not right....surprise.


mojo

Anonymous said...

Guerra, you seem to know alot about the facts in this case.
Do you happen to know, I read somewhere that some DNA was collected and the tests were done in England. Not sure why, seems to me that they shoudl be done in Portugual. But.. I heard that since then this DNA was "lost".

Truth?

Trustmeigetit (cant sign in under my blog on this computer so I have to use anon)



Anonymous said...

Guerra said" British woman, who claims to have seen Mr. McCann walking on the beach at night a few days after the child went missing, has disappeared"

The fact that this disappeared must mean there was something big going on. I mean, to me it seems totally innocent. I mean, the sad dad is just walking on the beach. Who cares? But if that really did disappear, then that means that Gerry was doing something on that beach that night.

That is a very interesting statement.

I sure am sick of the McCann’s getting away with all this BS. And what is wrong with Portugal. Why are they letting the British walk all over them?

The crime happened in Portugal so how and why the British have been allowed to sorta takeover is something I just don’t understand.

They have no jurisdiction so they need to get the hell out of it.

I am so for Goncalo. I hope he wins again.

Gerry and Kate have spent all their energy fighting Pat and Goncalo when they should have been looking for their child. The simple fact that they have not, to me screams that they are guilty aside from all the evidence.

I hope someway somehow this bites them in the a#$!!



Trustmeigetit (cant sign in under my blog on this computer so I have to use anon)

Anonymous said...

The most annoying statement made by the Mccanns over this trial delay...

"We just want justice. This is not fair."


They want justice for them. They have not had this amount of effort to get justice for Madeleine.

But for them, they want justice.

Stop fighting theories and fight for your child.

Yes, I believe Madeline is dead, but I promise you, I would care less about someones theory if my child was missing.

Their actions just keep proving to us she is no longer alive to be found.
Trustmeigetit (cant sign in under my blog on this computer so I have to use anon)


Anonymous said...


My question at present is very simple.

1.is this case legitimate?...what are the legal ramifications of the ward of court status in this case?

anyone?

Mojo

Pat Brown said...

Anon 12:48

I personally disagree. IF I were innocent of any wrongdoing in what happened to my child, I might well want to sue Goncalo Amaral for his aggressive campaign to claim my guilt and deter the public from supporting any public or private investigation into the disappearance of my child that did not include me.

NONE of us has been in that kind of situation, so we cannot that we would only focus on the search for our child and squelch our anger and rage at a renegade detective trashing us in the media and on the bookstands. Myself, I get what the McCanns are doing, be they innocent or guilty. In fact, I think this aspect of their behavior, rage against Amaral is actually one piece of behavioral evidence that ways in FAVOR of their innocence because normally people who do in their kids pretend that they can forgive and forget everyone's anger or suspicion. On the other hand, innocent parents are more likely to admit their failure as parents (leaving unattended children) while psychopathic parents (or narcissistic ones) will argue this.

So, I expect the McCanns behavior over leaving their children understandable if guilty (also if only guilty of neglect) but their rage at Amaral and their insistence on getting Scotland Yard involved are behaviors more indicative of innocence as is not dropping the matter and going quietly into the night.

So if there wasn't so much other evidence that points to the McCanns, physical and behavioral, and there wasn't an extremely bizarre intersection with politics, high powered lawyers, and the fund, I might well think the McCanns were neglectful parents, but not guilty of more.

And, if I think this and the only thing that dissuades me is the much more evidence that the public has never read, I would grant many feel great sympathy for the McCanns at the delay of the trial and totally empathize with their tirade against Amaral.

Hence, unless there is some clever, clever strategy going on here, I think it was a bad move for Amaral.

Anonymous said...


Pat...would / should any of this be taking place?

is the case legitimate ? has the Ward of court issue been resolved.

mojo

Anonymous said...

Kate McCann now says..
'It brings us more pain and distress every time we come here. We just want justice.'

yet this is the woman who says she returns to Portugal twice a year?? Why keep going back if it is so distressing!

Anonymous said...

Pat, I agree that this might be a bad move by Amaral. I commented above about the Ward of Court issue - and as mojo says above, it all seems very questionable (at least to my lay opinion!)

Perhaps Goncalo believed that the Ward of court question was being so badly handled that he had no recourse but to turn to these tactics: believing that the court had become a McCann theatre and that he had nothing more to lose.

But that would be a huge call to make, and a massive risk.

I presume (hope) that he has representation in hand. This would be a massive case to have to take on with so little notice. (I wonder if he has UK representation re: his battle for access to the Ward of Court documents.)

All conjecture!! But I hope he knows what he is doing.

guerra said...

Trustmeigetit, forensic testing was done in Portugal and England.

I believe floor tiles from the McCanns apartment were sent to England, along with some plant material from the garden, textile fibres, hairs and what they believed to be bodily fluids.

The people at the now defunct FSS laboratory communicated to the Portuguese police that they would be destroying forensic samples which they deemed perishable and a health risk. In the case files it is stated that these samples would not be returned to Portugal unless requested by the Defence to preserve them. I have no idea what that means.

They also told the Portuguese that they would be destroying the non perishable samples that they tested in accordance with some statute of theirs unless they received written instructions not to do so.

Anonymous said...


Pat.

What campaign has Goncalo Amaral conducted? aggressively?

I must be honest Pat I totally disagree with your last post regarding their actions of wanting Scotland yard involved demonstrates behaviours of innocence.
Not in this case ...it is more than obvious in my opinion that this is all a one sided sham and they are supported by SY and the British Government...its not even hidden.

I am hoping this case really starts to get opened up, Goncalo needs to sing like a canary.

Mojo


MRSFeeX said...

I do know, if something bad happens to children, the parents often blame theirself for it.
Even if it is not their mistake.
Parents do feel to protect their children, or preventing from harm.
They feel failing when something bad happens.
Even a disease can be something like a punishment from 'God'
Also named Karma..
Eitherway..
When something bad happens it strikes the family to.
Not always to be healed or 'get closer'

The most abducted children are taqken by their own (fighting) parents.
The most murdered also by their own parents.
Abduction by a stranger is from the street, Kampbush, Peggy Knobloch, Nymphe poolman)
The Dutrouxgirls..all on the street.
The wrong place, the wrong time.
So not likely to observe a well taking and cared girl.
The abducter took the biggest child?






So when G said, no prove of any harm..
Well childrapers do mess up children, in many ways.
But SY also said she was probaly dead when she left 5a.
So .. a 'necro' did it?




Anonymous said...


2.53pm

great post

In my opinion that is what it is...a McCann theatre.

nail head

mojo

Pat Brown said...

Mojo,

I didn't say it wasn't a sham...what I said was if you take the behavior on its own and not in context to the totality of evidence, then one might think the McCann' lawsuit against Amaral and Bennett and their removal of my book from Amazon are innocent parents fighting against haters who are trying to ruin their family and name along with their efforts to find Madeleine. I am not saying that is what I believe as a profiler with the totality of evidence.

As for Goncalo being aggressive, hell, yeah, he is! To deny that is being silly. Goncalo wouldn't go away quietly, he published a book claiming the evidence showed the McCanns to be guilty, and he has been up front in the press. I have likewise have been aggressive with my book, blogs and public debate. In return, the McCanns have also been aggressive with a high profile legal firm. If Goncalo and I are wrong, then the McCanns have a right to be aggressive in return. If Goncalo and I are right, then we are standing up for justice but at one hell of a risk. I can certainly say that speaking out publicly and writing my books and blogs has done me no good and Goncalo has fared much worse. But, both of us believe we are doing the right thing and are willing to accept whatever happens, even if we lose everything but integrity in the end (but, I fully admit, I don't stand to lose much at this point and Goncalo just about everything, so he is the hero here for having the courage to go forth into the storm).

Anonymous said...



Goncalo Amaral..if you read here...it is time.

Fight With all your strength. Do not pull any punches any longer...Get everything out there.

Trust only those very close.

Walk tall and know you are in the right - reclaim your dignity.
For You and your family.

you have the public with you in huge numbers, People know you are the Good Guy.
Get more visible - use every means possible.

Don't worry about the future, you are going to be okay I promise.

Fight.

Mojo

Anonymous said...


Pat.

I am sorry - I may have misinterpreted what you meant.

That post has put me right and I agree with you on that reply.

When does passion spill into aggression...words can be so powerful.

Pat incidentally you are a fantastically courageous lady for what you have done in this case ...I feel the same about Joana Morais.

The work you have all put in is incredible and I know we all take you for granted.

Your special people and if I may say damned fine too.

Mojo

Anonymous said...

Pat Brown seems to be changing his opinion ??

Anonymous said...


@ 3.55 pm...hello

can you be specific please ?

mojo

My opinion is clear.

Pat Brown said...

Yes, Mojo, passionate is another good word! Clearly, Tony Bennett has also been so and, Joana, I think exemplifies this word the best of all of us. She has worked so hard for justice in this case and in support of Goncalo and, though all of the years, has done so with exceptional grace and politeness. She is a wonderful person and I feel lucky to have spent time together with her in Portugal when she hosted my stay there.

MRSFeeX said...

3.55
Think she explains how strong feelings work.
Aggression or Depression.
Can go both way.
This is hard.. and getting hitting harder.
This case will go on for years, I think.
The girl(or body) will never be found.
So..'new prove'I dont think so..
(Unless, the body is in such a good condition.( fingerprints or dna on it like blood/sperm by the killer will found or can be traced)
(or alive Madeleine returning)
But I dont think so..
Unlikely
The statistics are real.
Steve Stayner did return to his family..
They had a great deal of suffering.
'It didnt end' by returning I think..or ended to be a happy family.
To much destroyed.
Or mabye the media took over..
If.. (I dont think so..)
Madeleine will return..
Sfter all.
Can you imagine how it will be in their hometown?
The UK is good in horror.
Clarence knows..
Rose and Fred
The Fritzl children were not exposed to the media.
It would be cruel to do so..





Pat Brown said...

Anon 3:55

First, I am a her, not a him, but I do not see any place where I have changed my mind about much. I still fully believe the evidence does not support an abduction and points toward the McCanns, I still support Goncalo in his fight to purport his theory, and I still hold out little hope for the McCanns to be investigated properly at any point in the future. I hold a 50/50 odds that Goncalo will win in court.

Anonymous said...

Pat.

In my opinion there is no legal case, the woc would mean its void in its present format.

Why has this not been resolved...some very expensive lawyers and they cant determine the law.

if it is correct that its void....what is the judge doing giving platforms to void cases.

it stinks

It just surreal ....no 50/50 if they haven't if got a legit case.

its should be in the bag 100% for Goncalo...no ifs, no buts......just as the previous court ruled.

All the rest is spin in my opinion

mojo

Pat Brown said...

Mojo,

The Ward of Court thing is only a part of the case, that the McCanns can't represent Madeleine in an action. They can still represent themselves and the twins, so there is a case, unfortunately.

Anonymous said...

Pat

when I say all the rest is spin ..im talking of what's been played out on the court steps.

The McCann's are angry because in my opinion they know the woc is a huge legal issue, it would not surprize me if the British CPS get involved in a coalition with the McCann's to ratify the proceedings.

Could Goncalo be forcing their hand ....so the world see what's going on and who he's really fighting.

any thoughts

mojo

Anonymous said...

Pat.

That well may be the case...but has the necessary amendments been completed to legitimise the proceedings....there will be a legal framework that will need to be followed.
Has it?

again fundamental to law that correct processes are followed.
Cases are thrown out on these type of issues.

mojo

Anonymous said...

is this worth Pondering for a moment?

If Madeleine McCann's name needs to be removed from the court document because of the Ward of court status then surely the money that was set aside in the initial claim needs to be re-worked.

Is that portion of money no longer part of the claim to be returned.

remember the figure was made up divided by family members.


Mojo

Anonymous said...

Too bad when they state that this book is hurting the search for their child that they cant then be asked.....

Well, if you think the book hurst the search, what about those E-fits your private investagtors had that you refused to share with the public.
I think a sketch of a man carying a child near your resport the night Madeleine was missing was pretty important to the search for Madeleine. More so that a book that simply has a different theory. A theory that was already public information.

So, do you really care about the search or is this about money or just your anger towards Goncalo?

If only...

Anonymous said...


I believe that of the 1.2 million that was calculated ..430,000 was the sum claimed for Madeleine.

If The WOC prevents that portion...why has that not been resolved.

can everyone see what is happening.

Mojo

Anonymous said...

I hope everyone pushes this point raised on the Ward of court and not get caught up in the spin of the other events.

This needs sorting and resolving before anything else proceeds in the case.

Instead we get attacks on Goncalo Amaral accusing him of tactics, revenge etc

Do the powers that be think the public are stupid.

Mojo

Pat Brown said...

Mojo,

I don't pretend to understand civil law procedures nor the Portuguese legal system. All I know is that courts around the world sometimes are fair and sometimes are not. One thing I am terribly uncomfortable with is that any case takes a ridiculously long time to come to a close because that reeks to me of too much legal wrangling and manipulation and not a straightforward application of justice.

Anonymous said...

Pat, Mojo..similarly I don't know how the Ward of Court issue will be viewed. I would have thought that since Madeleine is explicitly named alongside the parents and the twins that it can't simply be a matter of "oh well, let's just strike her name and get on with it." But maybe that is the view the judge has taken. I don't know.

Trying to look at things from Amaral's point of view, and to wonder why he has made such a huge call I can only see a couple of issues:

1. At the very outset he requested that the sessions should be behind closed doors, obviously fearing a media circus. Judge ruled against. Kate McCann turned up with a 'documentary' camera in tow.

2. The Ward of Court documents must, at the very least, have a strong bearing on how the outcome/settlement is gauged. Having initially denied the McCanns the opportunity to make statements to the court, the judge does an about turn and rules that irrespective of the WoC implications the McCanns will be given a platform...and only then will she make it clear what status the WoC issue holds. The fact that she conducts things in this order is a pretty clear indication already.

*Pehaps* Amaral has come to feel that he's on a hiding to nothing. I hope not, because that wasn't the impression I got from they way the judge received the witness testimony. But Amaral may have been advised differently.

Anonymous said...


There is no need to speculate....it should be resolved period in my opinion.

Goncal Amaral is been stitched up with corruption.
The courts are not supposed to work this way.

Portugal are trying to stitch one of their citizens up on behalf of the UK.

Its a disgrace ....it should not be allowed to happen.

this is pure evil ...its time for protests

help help.....I will not accept this, I will not bury my hand in the sand.

Its a kangaroo court

mojo

Anonymous said...


Amnesty international don't want to know I have just phoned them.

This is all theatre ..the biggest conspiracy to grace the planet is been played out.

My God I hope the world wakes up to the police states of the UK and Portugal.

This is a concerted effort to nail the good guy because so many professional people and government run organisations are involved.

No longer anyone fool themselves that is about law and the complexities involved .....that is lies.

Goncalo Amaral should not even be in court.

Mojo

Anonymous said...

«Do the powers that be think the public are stupid.»

I'll put this to you bluntly ... yes. And the public sometimes is, too.

v

Anonymous said...


5.33am

well I have raised some other points, can you answer them bluntly.

mojo

Anonymous said...

Mojo,

ok then, not sure what other points specifically, but to be blunt-blunt (and i know you will not agree with me), ever since i read that GM was on Comare my opinion on the whole thing has made a complete U-turn (I used to think the MC's story was true, now I most certainly don't).
These two are being protected by the nuclear industry itself (via the British Gov); why? Because the nuclear industry is so generous and magnanimous? no, because they do not want stuff to be disclosed that GM possibly has the ability to disclose.
The MC are lying, the British Gov is lying, SY is lying.
Poor GA was caught in the middle of it all and has become the culprit (as innocent people often will, in these cases)
Not sure what else you wanted me to tell you bluntly or how bluntly ... :-)
V

Anonymous said...

I have read Amaral's book.In my opinion he has only put on paper what is in the PJ reports and then he provides his opinion on what he considers might have happened.
My feeling is that it's immoral for this pair to sue for libel -after all they did leave their children alone. One is missing and not a single sign of what might have happened has ever been found.

When you go out leaving your home unlocked and your valuables in plain sight can you claim from your insurance company for anything that has gone missing or "been stolen"? No! That is because without proof of burglary/breaking and entering and with a lack of anything that might indicate someone had been in your house, there is no way to prove that you had in fact been burgled.
They might spend their time better actually looking for their missing daughter but instead they dismiss all possible sightings out of hand. Strange behaviour.
What kind of lives are the twins leading when their parents all consuming task is to keep on about the one child who has disappeared. I feel so sorry for the twins, it's hard to 'compete' with a sibling who isn't around.

AnneGuedes said...

The WOC issue affects only the amount of damages granted. Madeleine's parents, representing her, have asked for about 300 000 on her behalf. If the High Court denies the McCanns the right to represent their daughter in such a trial, the judge will have to suppress Madeleine from among the plaintiffs. That's all.

Anonymous said...

Thanks very much for that Anne.

What I still find incredible is that the McCanns have nevertheless been allowed to make 'the search' for Madeleine a central claim in their pursuit of Amaral. This would be 'the search' for a child for whom they have abdicated the right to legally represent.
It's my understanding that the judge gave the McCanns one month after the final hearing to provide documentation that might show that they can represent Madeleine.
I think that Amaral would have every right to expect that this be made clear prior to the McCanns being allowed to make a statement and prior to effective closure of evidence.

AnneGuedes said...

January last minute WOC issue was Santos Oliveira's idea.
The McCanns appealed against the judge's decision not to hear them.
A higher jurisdiction decided they could.
When the judge, after reviewing all the process last December, stated she wouldn't hear the parties, it was likely because she didn't need it.
Thinking that the McCanns' speeches will change the judge's mind is wishful thinking (imo).

Anonymous said...

I agree entirely about the speeches. In fact despite my misgivings here, I remain hopeful for Amaral. My concern is that he has made an unusual call by 'sacking' his lawyer and I wonder what might be behind such a move.

For the sake of clarity though - and for the sake of the closing arguments that his team might want to make, I believe the WOC issue has been badly (and opaquely) handled. It's implications might arguably be more than monetary and this ought to have been made clear.

My hope is that the judge is wanting to be seen to be giving the McCanns every opportunity to present a case so that the final judgement will have unquestioned authority. I hope so!!

AnneGuedes said...

According to the judge herself, the presence of Madeleine among the plaintiffs is just a technicality with no consequence on her sentence but an eventual consequence over the attribution of damages to the plaintiff Madeleine.
This depends on the McCanns capacity to provide an authorization from the High Court to represent their daughter in this trial since the judge, studying the WOC document found that the trial was concerned by the High Court ruling.
Actually they likely have already applied, so the delay will be more than 30 days. Moreover, as the delay starts right after the last hearing and as the delay is suspended during the 5 weeks Tribunal holidays, they'll have over 11 weeks to get the document.
Remember that Amaral's lawyer got the WOC document after about 4 months..
However I don't think the High Court will authorize.

Anonymous said...


Ann.

Is there a legal framework that gives guidelines on the WOC.

Is the judge using discretion or legal guidelines regarding her decisions on proceeding with the case.
If she is using guidelines from a legal framework can anyone access this document?

Either way.

A defendant surely as a human right to know what he is been accused of and by whom without any confusion.

It should be clearly marked on the legal paperwork given to him and legal team.

It would logically follow that any potential financial implication is clear, when the case began, we were told the amount.. 1.2 million.. was made up to represent the family members, damages were aligned to each one at various amounts, it should be documented.
That Document is INVALID because it does not clearly or truthfully reflect the case Now.. or how the calculation for the compensation has been affected.

In my opinion this leaves the defendant facing a case that has no clear defined remit.

Surely in any fair case....a defendant should be clear of what exactly he is been sued for and by whom.

He knew at the beginning of the trial, however the WOC has changed that.

its a nonsense to dress it any other way in my opinion....and I am still not convinced that something very eerie isn't happening.

It will be no good people moaning about verdicts they didn't see coming after the event.

in my opinion if it doesn't look right.....its usually not.

mojo

Anonymous said...

There is the technical issue of Madeleine's name as plaintiff, but I think that there is also an argument about Madeleine as object of 'the search'. The McCanns have presumed to represent Madeleine on both counts.
Emotionally that is entirely fair. But legally there remains a distinction and I think that Amaral's team deserve that to be made clear. 'The search' is not a legal entity, and the McCanns have signed away the legal right to represent the object of that search.
I don't necessarily regard this as 'dark' manoeuvring, but it is messy and presumptive to leave these questions adrift, until long after the final hearing.

Anonymous said...


@11.48

There are human beings on both sides that have emotions...that should never be forgotten.

If the issues are technical, they should be resolved ....clear path identified to both parties...and continue in a just way.

Why cant that be the approach?

Personally I think its much more serious than messy.

mojo




Anonymous said...

Mojo..
"There are human beings on both sides that have emotions.."
You're right of course, and that is my concern. When people fall into despair they sometimes cut themselves off from those best placed to help them. That's my worry for Dr Amaral. He has made a huge call at the very last step of the way, and I only hope that it was made with a clear mind.
Anon11.48

Anonymous said...

OMG how is it a huge call that Dr Amaral made. The only risk he was taking was delaying the heartfelt speechs of the saintly couple for a couple of weeks. I have a good feeling for the reasons he did it but either way its not going to be make much difference to the final outcome and from what i have seen to date there is not much chance of him losing

Anonymous said...

He has done the right thing in my opinion, Goncalo Amaral has come to far and lost to much not to see it through in the right way.

Sorry everyone to keep banging on about this WOC issue.....but people are brushing it off without it getting bottomed out, and its not a small thing is it, Madeleine is central to the claim against Goncalo that's been made.

Gerry McCann said on the steps outside the court...its about Madeleine not them....well words to that effect.

The parents can not represent Madeleine! that judgement has been confirmed!......please someone tell me what is going on?

The WOC has confirmed they cannot represent her.......its not a small insignificant part...its central to the case.

Has Goncalo Amaral given any thoughts regarding the judges decision to continue the case, is he happy about that.. given the trouble he went through to get the WOC documentation, and even though its recognized the parents cannot continue legally with Madeleine named on their claim...they are still going to anyway because its not important to the judge.

yep makes sense that ....
A case centred around ..eh..ar..eh?.we will let you know the detail when were finished.

"O okay super" ...Goncalo is expected to say.

seriously its not right, I am not convinced this is legal what's taking place....it makes no sense whatsoever.

Mojo

Anonymous said...

"OMG how is it a huge call that Dr Amaral made."
It is a huge call because at approx half an hours notice he effectively pulled the plug on the final hearing. He is perfectly entitled to do this, but there is also every chance that the judge will not take kindly to the move.

He has just ten days to replace his lawyer and brief her/him on what is a massively complex case requiring a final statement, perhaps further written applications, and then who knows...an appeal? an application to the European Courts etc.

We know for a fact that he and his previous lawyer had worked closely for many months (if not years) in preparation for this. All of that briefed expertise is no longer there for him.

Amaral himself cannot have felt that "there is not much chance in losing". The dismissal of Santos Oliveira obviously reflects the opposite. Amaral must have had either a precise technical grievance (maybe the WOC), or maybe he has made a 'gut' call about how he wants to be represented.
Either way it is not an ideal scenario and represents a certain risk; on the other hand, yes, Amaral must believe that their are opportunities too arising from a change.
I also desperately hope that he has done the right thing. He is a remarkable man, and this is a typically unexpected and, either way, a courageous call.

Anonymous said...

«He is perfectly entitled to do this, but there is also every chance that the judge will not take kindly to the move.»

Portuguese judges see this sort of stuff happen every single day of their careers.
Besides, will she take kindly, you think, the fact that the McCanns have so blatantly, grotesquely and obtrusively tried to influence the outcome of the whole thing with the Scotland Yard rabbit they managed to pull out of the hat?
V

Anonymous said...

V, this is a civil case which are almost impossible to call. I hope that the judge sees through the McCanns and doesn't take kindly to all of their antics...their repeated delays, appeals for settlement, bizarre attempts to present 'the search' as some kind of legal reality etc etc. (the list is endless)

Whose f$€*ing side do you think I'm expressing here?

Despite misgivings about the WOC stuff, my feeling has always been that the judge appeared savvy and decisive and that Amaral has played a cool winning hand. For that very reason I find it very unexpected that he should sack his lawyer, and I wonder why.

Santos Oliveira has stated emphatically that this was not a delaying ploy from Amaral, and I believe him. Amaral has far too much dignity to get involved in those kinds of games. The fact that he behaves with so much assurance and class is what sets him apart from the McCanns and their hangers on.

So, I wonder why, that's all. Has something been communicated to Amaral that has motivated a change in his team? Are there technical issues that he feels could be exploited further? Etc.

Anonymous said...


Anon 4:29
«this is a civil case which are almost impossible to call»
Meaning you don't delay a court hearing because in Portugal you are fortunate to have one scheduled in the first place, right?
Maybe almost impossible for us normal citizens in Portugal; but as it has been established these people do whatever they want, where they want, any time they want. So that shouldn't really be a problem for anybody. Portugal is at their beck and call, as we have clearly seen in Luz over the last 2 or 3 weeks.

«So, I wonder why, that's all. Has something been communicated to Amaral that has motivated a change in his team? Are there technical issues that he feels could be exploited further? Etc»

Well, I don't know, but I feel it may have something to do with the Ward of Court thing. Apparently if the MCcann do not produce the letter in 30 days, GA is discharged from the proceedings. But maybe **he doesn't want that**. Maybe he wants this to go to the very end, as indeed it should. Maybe he believes (as I believe) that this case is giving the McCann just enough rope to hang themselves. As I have said before, because he has lost almost everything GA is in no hurry. But these two are, so time plays in favour of GA and he wants the case to continue and be properly finished with (as the refusal to settle seems to show). I know I would if I were him!
V.

Anonymous said...

I went back and re-read GA's statements on this and, no, he would not be discharged from the proceedings, just from the claim made on behalf of Madeleine. So forget what I wrote above.
Not functioning properly before a proper morning dose of caffeine ... :-(

Anonymous said...

V,
Look, I agree. I know exactly how Portugal has been treated over this. I have *never* been more ashamed to say that I am British...and that is saying something. Our authorities (and very often our tourists) behave like a bunch of xenophobic, narrow minded...arrogant.....well, you get the picture!!
Dr Amaral has every right to delay proceedings, the stakes are huge for him, and like you say, I think he wants this to play right to the bitter end.
I just wonder why this delay...and why now. I thought that his lawyer performed brilliantly for him, so there must be a reason.
Sure, there was some relish in seeing the McCanns so pissed by the delay!! But I know that what Amaral hopes for is something far bigger.

Yeah, I'm gonna make the blackest espresso too! :-))

Anonymous said...

Some have wondered whether he could represent himself at the proceedings and I am trying to find out. I am almost sure he cannot represent himself, considering the value of the case (amount for which he is being sued), not sure. But that could be a hypothesis.
V

Anonymous said...

I wondered that too. Santos Oliveira thought not - he said it might be too complex. But I am sure that someone with Dr Amaral's connections will know where to turn.

...ok...COFFEE!

Anonymous said...

Assuming he can represent himself in accordance with the law (which, i repeat, i don't think he can) I hope he doesn't!
Much as I admire him as a professional and as a person (the little I have seen), Amaral does not always come across as very articulate or commmunicative, rather austere, shy and reserved.
Although he is very inelligent, I do think he would benefit from letting a lawyer help him in this.

(and yes, now coffee, definitely :-))

V.

Anonymous said...

I repeat what I said earlier "OMG how is it a huge call that Dr Amaral made". In my opinion the case has been won as the saintly couple did not provide any witness's to coloborate their claim and as such even me (a non legal person) never mind a skilled alternative lawyer would be able to conduct a winning closing arguments in this case. I agree with the poster that GA and his lawyer is not into silly games and delaying tatics there no need for them to, they were holding a winning hand. Whatever caused GA to take the action was prompted by developments outside of the court roome

Anonymous said...

Anonymous @ 6:20 AM

I just saw a brief interview with GA on RTP (Portuguese state tv channel, I believe it was given yesterday (or at least it was released yesterday).
He looks confident, cool, self-assured, younger, fitter (granted, lost quite some weight, but then he needed to).
If the interview was given yesterday, this is not a man who's lost his mind and sacked his lawyer on a whim or something.
No, he looks gooooooood and confident!! He knows what he's doing.
So glad for him.
So, yes, basically, I agree with you.
With all my heart: best of luck to Gonçalo !!!
V

Anonymous said...

Okay...okay...you're beginning to convince me now!!

He looked very very well!

I'm a born worrier, that's all!!


;-)

Anonymous said...

V –
Good to hear about yesterday’s interview your description of him would be as I would expect it to be. GA has risked everything for his principles, career, reputation, family, money ....he had the opportunity to settle out of court and didn’t why?...for exactly the same reason that he was removed from the case in 2007 ... not just because he wanted to get to the truth, but because he knew that the truth always has to come out.
I live in a country when there have been very many cover-ups (Police, State, Religious etc) which cost 100s of millions of pounds in public enquiries. The exposure of cover ups not the actual crime committed have created humiliation and international damage to those who choose to cover up. Experience has told them that the truth cannot be buried forever. For that reason I don’t believe in a SY cover up. True I do think some nonsense has been sprouted (bin men etc) but surely the best cover ups provide plausible answers not nonsense. I think what we have with SY is not a review/investigation but a review/investigation/enquiry and the enquiry will have equal importance. The police/government have been cited as having withheld evidence and provided protection for suspects in death of a wee girl. The £6m+ that will have been spent on disproving this allegation or acting against people who did before it blows up in their face will be chickenfeed.
GA as one of these unique people that is prepared to risk everything in search for the truth and that takes intelligence and cunning. I don’t know why he has taken the action he has taken but the saintly couples “one flew over the Cuckoo’s” performance outside the court on Monday was just another example of how he has outfoxed them yet again. GA has always known that he is on the winning side, this court case is no exception even if we think his actions are a bit strange. this is not about one battele. No I think we are heading towards a climax in this whole sad affair and the good guys have won.

Anonymous said...


My view is that regardless of what people are predicting in the case ...the first hurdle is to establish is there a case?

I say no there is not!

Until the Woc issue is resolved and the legitimacy of what form the proceeding should take (if any) is clearly outlined...then as far as I am concerned the case has no legs.

Is the WOC issue is only deemed a technicality ? who by?

Is their a legal framework that can demonstrate what are classed as technicalities in law, so we can put some context around this alleged technicality.

The WOC changes the complete structure of the case! its needs resolving before anything else continues....its not a spelling mistake on a document, its the foundation of the case been made!!

okay lets approach this from another angle.
if You are to build a case against someone and to get it legally accepted......what do you have to demonstrate so the claim as legitimacy?

Does this claim by the McCann's meet that criteria.

Does anybody know why this is so difficult to get a committed answer to ?

mojo

guerra said...

There is a video of an interview given by Mr. Amaral on Joana Morais blog in which he gives a good summary of what all this is about:

Roughly translated: "Being paid or not 1.2 million euros is not what they're striving for." What they're trying to convey with this trial is: 'you see we're not even guilty'."

"And this is what is happening, this is what the entire Scotland Yard investigation is leading to. It's a farce in being politically correct or in defending something that for me is not only the McCann couple but that entire group, defending what took place among that group of doctors and is taking place in British society."

Anonymous said...

And you can bet your life guerra that the saintly couples heartfelt speeches would have rewritten and rehearsed to portray that " you see we are not guilty" which is what the english press would have reported the next day. Instead we had the drama of sacking lawyers reported and thrown in with it GA thoughts on how they disposed of the body. GA a victim i dont think so victims lie down and cry foul play until people get sick listening to them. Not GA even time they sat their bony backsides on the lovely lorraines couch GA was a thorn in their side releasing information on the case and making sure they never forgot he was there. That information never got to the great british public but it got to the people who mattered. As long as GA is around this case was never going to die and the mccanns would never get peace. Very soon I think GA will be the one sitting on couches.

Anonymous said...


In my opinion Goncalo is been set up for a fall in the court case that should not be.

I think the people who are positive are misguided, they are not looking at what is happening closely enough.

In my opinion he has fallen out with his lawyer over the WOC issue.
There is no point winning and establishing that they do NOT have the authority to represent Madeleine because of the WOC status, and then become inhibited to enforce what you have won and proven at great expense.

What was the point of establishing the WOC ...if it has no bearing...which it does....in LAW !

Lets me be clear.

The Case has no grounds in its present format. It has no legs and never did, but for some eerie reason not one of the high flyer lawyers recognised this when they made the lawsuit at the start.

It has been ESTABLISHED they do not have the authority to represent their daughter due to the WOC status.

The whole case has no grounds.

Not one of us need to discuss the case or predict anything, it doesn't exist ......it should be kicked out.

what is happening is not right, and if the case continues without the WOC issue resolved in law FIRST.

Then its a stitch up, plain and simple.

Mojo

Anonymous said...


in my opinion reading between the lines.
what is happening is thus

For the present lawsuit to have legitimacy in its present format i.e. ALL the named family members including Madeleine with the WOC in place.
Then it requires some additional steps to be made to legitimize the claim to allow the case to continue.

1. The British courts who are responsible and have authority for Madeleine join forces with the family - looking after the Madeleine side of the lawsuit.

2. or they sign over their authority to somebody else and the necessary documentation relevant to the lawsuit is produced to show and validate the case.

In my opinion the judge has made a decision using discretion to allow the case to continue with the view that all this can be sorted at the end retrospectively.

That is Fundamentally Wrong and not a fair or logical way to conduct such an important trial in my view.....to be honest in my opinion it doesn't seem legal.

But it does help the British courts who are responsible for madeleine, this way they are not been forced to appear or make a decision to pass on that authority under the glare of a live case and full media / public focus .....doesn't it.

one could even say ...When all the storm as died this can be done without public attention.

behind the curtains.

wink wink nudge nudge.

Mojo





Anonymous said...


please read....

The second is related to a Ward of Court which means that who ultimately has the responsibility and the tutelage of the child is the English High Court. This fact was already known to the McCanns at the moment when they filed this lawsuit. It's a shame that this wasn't done immediately at start by the previous defence lawyer but now that it is established and proven, so much so that there is an official decision which gives the McCanns 30 days to get the records of the English Court's authorization under penalty of absolving the defendant Gonçalo Amaral on the request made on behalf of the missing child, the unfortunate Maddie McCann, obviously. But that is done, it's good...

...............................
comment.

I find this paragraph above interesting ..its taken from the McCann files website and is part of the interview with Goncalo Amaral's (ex) lawyer. It raises some questions.

1. McCann's 30 days to get the records of the English Court's authorization

from when ?

does the date to produce fall after the 10 days Goncalo has been given ?

I bet it does

Look its clear as daylight anything they request from the UK Authorities they will get, be 100% sure of that.

This libel case is looking dodgier by the minute.

These are major issues surrounding the WOC and should be sorted before the trial re commences if their is such a thing as Justice.

Am I alone in my thinking about all this?

mojo

Anonymous said...

I think both previous posts raise very good points re WOC but i wouldn't be so sure that the UK courts will agree to provide the assurrance the mccanns need. The judge is is being very clever in making her ruling that she thinks there that the mccanns didnt have the authority to bring the case but she is batting it right back at the UK to contradict her. This will be a nightmare for the uk court service, its one thing a group of scum newspaper editors providing digustingly bias reporting of this case its quite another for the uk court service to blatantly tell lies.

Anonymous said...

@3.12

No I don't agree.

the Judge should not resume the trial until this Point in Law (WOC) is resolved its fundamental.


The case has no LEGAL legs....its theatre.

That's why no one will answer my post....this trial as no legs in LAW.

Its a show.....allowing the McCann's a platform they have no Legal grounds for.


I will be clear.

THERE IS NO LEGAL CASE AT PRESENT.

conclusion should read

THE COURT AS NO LEGITIMACY.
CASE KICKED OUT


mojo

Anonymous said...



I would also like to highlight - that this (illegal) libel trial that is taking place has been suspended while SY carried out their search for the papers/public.

As soon as they finished - the trial re-opens.

Yet the trial will not wait 30days for the McCann's to produce the paperwork concerning the WOC to give the trial legitimacy in its proceedings

Without doubt Portugal are working with the UK on this.

Can anyone find me the date that the 30 days begins from?

Mojo

Anonymous said...



Does anyone care for justice?

I am positive there are people who read here that no this is a kangaroo court we are witnessing.

Can I pay a lawyer to look into this WOC point ..to establish in LAW that what is proceeding is illegal.

because it is.

Mojo

Anonymous said...

Hi mojo,
Yes, Anne said above "Actually they likely have already applied, so the delay will be more than 30 days. Moreover, as the delay starts right after the last hearing and as the delay is suspended during the 5 weeks Tribunal holidays, they'll have over 11 weeks to get the document."
So.."right after the last hearing" (discounting holidays).

It is worth remembering that this judge reduced more than one of the McCann's witnesses to blithering wrecks. She made them look unqualified, ill prepared and downright absurd. Think back to Mr Pike and Mr Wright. She extended to them a rope, and they dutifully hung themselves from it.

Law is an ass. It may well be that this judge has ruled on the WOC issue in the only way that was open to her (in law), but that doesn't necessarily mean that it's importance might not shape her opinions in other ways.

Mr Pike's qualifications (or lack of) might also be thought to be a technical detail, but there was no way that the judge was going to let that matter rest. If the McCanns were trying to pass him off as an 'expert witness', qualified to express a clinical/psych assessment, then she wanted to know whether he had the right credentials.
What are the McCann's own credentials when it comes to the representation of their daughter and 'the search' for her? The judge may not need to put that question explicitly to the court for it to influence her final thinking. They signed away the guardianship of Madeleine in 2007, so there would be her answer (at least in part).
Witnesses of dubious integrity and parents of dubious legal standing - now desperate to present themselves as legal guardians of 'the search' if not the little girl.

Dr Amaral *did* appear incredibly assured, whereas Duarte has been peppering her Facebook page with expletives. It's a career breaker for Duarte, and she certainly doesn't ooze certainty!

Anonymous said...


Hello 2.35.

I don't care what the judge makes people look like in a court that should not be and has no base in law.
All that stuff gets forgot about - what stands the test of Time is the VERDICT.
the rest means nothing !

This case has no legal legs.

The WOC needs sorting first .....then you would see that the trial can not go ahead.

this illegal libel trial is showing to be nothing more than a stage for the Mccanns.

Its a MISTRIAL if it proceeds.

mojo

trustmeigetit said...

I think sometimes guilty people who are narcissistic will fight to support their lie just for the sake of supporting it.

I follow the blog by Peter Hyatt on Statement Analysis. Hailey Dunn is a case about a 13 year old girl that went missing. Peter talked about the case in depth on his blog.

The mom, Billie Jean Dunn lied over and over. She to me is like the poster child for liars.

Yet, instead of crawling into a hole as she was called out on lies, she lied more. She became so bent on proving that she wasn’t lying that she even called Peter out and offered to be on his talk radio show. Which ended in her being called out on a lie and her hanging up on him but not before she cussed him out.

She elected to come on his show to prove him wrong. She failed… Yet she still stands by her lies.

But some people just live like that.



I think the Mccann’s have a few things going on here. Could be wrong or right. Just my theories

I think it’s possible that maybe the money coming in to the Kate and Gerry … I mean “Find Madeleine” fund may have started to see fewer donations. Maybe they figured the book was the cause. I mean, THEY need that money! They have bills to pay, trips to take.

I also think part of it trying to keep the lie alive. The book really makes them look bad. So, even Pat herself this supports innocence to some degree. I know I personally have read tons of comments that people say “why would they go after him if they are guilty”. That reason right there shows it is working. I mean, very few people would be so daring to do this if they were guilty.

And last, Kate and Gerry have always been right there in the media. They have blamed and insulted everyone but refused to take any credit for even just the simple neglect. They have used the media to rake in the donations and the sympathy and even despite allegations the fund was not being used to actually find Madeleine they have not bothered to come out and prove where the money was spent.



I think they are horrible people. I think they are selfish and cold and especially Gerry have egos beyond imagination.

Sorta the how dare you question me mind set.

Anonymous said...

Has mojo taken over your blog, Pat? (No offence, mojo x)

Anonymous said...

Last few posters brilliant with pat and the like if you continuing to tell it how it is , there is no way no matter how long it takes that the mccanns will get away with this. Poster in mcçann lies such a clear explanation on how their mind works. Well done Mojo keep it up Woc big issue but as anon 2.35 says thst judge one smart cookie. I for one trust her to do the right thing.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous 2:35 PM,

thank you very much for your post. Very informative and interesting.

V.

Anonymous said...


I have been trying to get more information about ward of courts ...

Has anyone tried to ?

http://www.judiciary.gov.uk/glossary

Look what happens.

can anyone help with a link to the Law on this.

Mojo

Anonymous said...

I don't know Mr Amaral personally but I know of him so to speak from what I have read and seen.

This is a policeman who has tangled with case hardened drug dealers so
some English toffs wearing cravats and yacht shoes isn't the reason as to why he is saying what he is saying.

Mitchell is no more or no less a better PR spokeperson than any other spokesperson, it is who may stand behind him that gives him confidence. The WHO? gives rise to the WHY?

This to me seems to be Mr Amaral's interest and he thinks that this case will never be solved until somebody ( or bodies)
gain the toy dolls ( That's a Scottish phrase - look it up ) to get a grip of the investigations.

That means Governments putting their collective feet down and intervening in a positive way instead of a negative ( how will this look to our populace and how can we use this to our advantage?) way.

That is as long as what Mr Amaral is claiming isn't true.

I don't think he arrived at these conclusions on a whim. As I said he is an ex drugs copper and he will have no doubt come across the Portuguese versions of MI5 and MI6 and probably will have his contacts within these agencies.

Inside info - if you like.

Re: The WOC issue if you read the articles on the mccannfiles the
lawyer representing the parents rattled of a ton of old cobblers ( an English saying ) in respect of precedent etc in Lord Justice Hogg,s Court. In my opinion what happened in that Court is unprecedented. Maybe the current Portuguese Judge wishes for some of this cobblers to be clarified?

Talking of ' Clarification ' the chosen one is quoted as saying that Madeleine IS a Ward of Court. He certainly earns his pay stating the obvious doesn't he? But Lord Justice Hogg came out with a biggee for me. Namely that Madeleine became a Ward of THIS
Court. That could infer that Madeleine was a Ward of another Court prior to THIS one? Perhaps another one within The Family Division?

Maybe the Portuguese Judge needs clarification on which Court she is dealing with here?

Family Courts are quite rightly protective of their Wards and may not want to reveal info on their Wards to the public so maybe she is taking a softly softly approach to the WOC affair. She may have her own inside info too?

Pure opinion.


Anonymous said...

@ 6.31.

interesting post.

What types of situations would a child become a ward of the court ?

Is it Possible to have two WOC's legally for the same child?

or Would the latter Court used have to complete a transfer from an existing authority to legitimise its control.

Would this transfer leave an audible trail of paperwork?

Would Goncalo Amarals legal team have a right to legal access to such documentation if that had happened.

Just as a question ....are wards of court used in adoption.

mojo

Anonymous said...

Mojo, no adoption processes are entirely separate; although a child who is a WOC may very well be placed into foster care...

Informally stated WOC is usually applied when a child or other vulnerable person is thought to be at risk in some way. The High Court effectively takes control of all major decision making on behalf of that person. In most cases this is obviously to remove the parents from that position. It effects decisions such as where the child lives, their education, medical authorisations and so forth.

It appears that the judge in this case has correctly ruled that bringing a libel action in Madeleine's name *is* such a major decision, and that the parents would therefore require authorisation to proceed. Whether that authorisation can be retrospective I don't know (trying to discover).

Two points then:

1. Would Madeleine's inclusion on the initial libel action invalidate the entire process? Pragmatically it would appear not. Whether there is a technical case for such an argument I don't know, but perhaps Amaral himself is now keen to see this through to a judgement regardless of that point. (Rather than potentially face another lengthy claim).

2. (More interesting I think)..why was Madeleine included in the first place? As regards the twins and the parents themselves the argument is primarily one of emotional harm, but how on earth could Madeleine be grouped together with such a claim? She has 'disappeared'...'unharmed' says Gerry...and so who could possibly testify as to her damaged mental state?!

No, she was named because the parents are trying to create the impression that they represent her with respect to the spurious notion of "everybody has the human right to be searched for" (says Gerry). But of course that is a heap of bollocks. The only searches that are privileged *in law* are those conducted by the authorities. Hampering a police search is indeed a criminal offence (as the McCanns know very well).; and even if this were not the case, even if 'the search' for Madeleine was privileged in law, the McCanns would have no more right to represent Madeleine in that instance as they would in any other....ie NONE..she is a WOC!!

On reflection, it appears to me that all of this revolves around an impression that the McCanns are trying to impress upon the court (and of course the media) most of which has very little to do with any legal substance (aside from the emotional harm they claim).

If "everyone has the human right to be searched for", then why not oppose this with the simple argument that "everyone has the human right to suggest that the search is futile". Freedom of Speech is actually a Human Right!

I think that it is all smoke and mirrors.

Looking back over Anne's reports, I'm reasonably assured that the judge will see as much!

(Sorry..a very long comment)

Anonymous said...

@ 6.30am

Thank you I appreciate the reply.
Its an excellent post.

In my opinion you have covered what's happening perfectly.....though I don't hold the confidence with the Judge that others do.

My reason for that is letting the case proceed, along with the way all the events in the media closes/ reopens around the McCann's and always to their benefit never Goncalo Amarals.

We need to remember that Portugal and the UK authorities are involved ...would the courts in Portugal allow a verdict to pass which will be the beginnings of highlighting serious corruption in their country as well as opening the spotlight to instigators the UK ?

The political pressures must be immense backstage.
You see its not about this case .....its what it will lead too.

We only have to refresh our minds at places like the McCann files website to realise what has gone on .....it beggars belief.

As much as we may wish a positive and just verdict...it doesn't make it happen.

I feel that these Points in LAW should be addressed and resolved in the eye of the storm - before the case continues.

Mojo


Anonymous said...

Thanks for that mojo,
I agree that all of this would have been far better dealt with before the case continues, and I'd be lying if I said that I was entirely easy about it.. But I am very glad that Dr Amaral has remained engaged with the process and would appear to have appointed a new lawyer.

Of course you're right, this whole trial has been placed under immense pressure.

All the best,
Anon 6.30

Anonymous said...


It seems we have more eerie goings on in this no legs libel/damages trial.....that hasn't bothered to ensure the criteria for WOC as yet....but aye not to worry, it just one among many dodgy things that are happening in my opinion.

Presumption of death act!

Reading between the lines the UK have not ratified this law as yet.
you can read about it on the missing people website.

In a nutshell after 7 years if there is no proof of the missing person been alive then they can be presumed dead....in LAW

something in the UK is stalling the finalisation ! surprise surprise.

It would seen everything that can be done to assist the McCann is been done....would you not agree?

We also at present are told the McCann's can give statements to the court yet Goncalo cannot ...

0h and any cross examination of the McCann's must be through the judge and not directly.

Yep looks a really fair trial so far.

It seems the case taking place is exempt from LAW.

Its like picking a winner on the X factor.
start practising your singing and dance routines.

You never know

Mojo

Anonymous said...

@ Its not clear why the woc wasnt resolved?
The decided case about neglect came from britain, from a unknown social worker?
Some files have become secret, yet madeleine is out of social servicecs duristriction, since she went missing abroad?
I have wonderd if amaral requested them files, since they were using her name for a libel case?
And by whos authority such information is being witheld?
One of the other problems not in the maCcanns favor, the alleged evidence has come from freinds and family?
Gerry has missed the point about a review, this isnt a open court, this case is determined by professionals, no jury?
This leaves a hole in the assertion of suicide, not gone before a medical council or tribunal to validate any libel?
How can kate validate such a claim, at a time where they wasnt botherd about being suspects, because they knew they were innocent, so the book did not damage any search?
Just a opinion.

Anonymous said...

http://www.vip.pt/55612a8/mod_artigos_obj_moda.aspx?sid=676abec2-d437-40b2-bd06-9ca0a4316990&cntx=HWhf7C2xeesRBsBwMlGCLWLeWREKV67YWZWD7miFP1nSURNFxH5toxSUGaxNSeKz

GONÇALO AMARAL Sick and bankrupt.

Former responsible for the investigation into the disappearance of Maddie, not to hear the case that put him on the verge of misery.
date: Sunday, June 22, 2014 at 17:30

"At this stage, I do not want to even hear the case."This was the reaction of Gonçalo Amaral, former Inspector of Judicial Police (PJ) and SIC commentator, to be contacted by VIP to rule on the searches done in the Algarve. And the reason is simple: the former investigating officer is facing serious economic difficulties, allegedly because of the case of Madeleine McCann. Moreover,he suffers from a serious illness (diabetes last degree) that has weakened a lot.

"He is very ill. Lost over 50 pounds and is closed with her ​​father. Have not the SIC program, presented by Julia Pine, has gone. The Maddie case gave him out of life, both personal and professional terms. Now, with the searches were made ​​in the Algarve, it seems that, after all, he was right.The very British authorities believe the girl may be dead. Otherwise, these steps do not make sense. It's funny the McCanns are so quiet, "said an official of the VIP Judicial Police Algarve, authority that accompanied the searches done on the ground by the British." So far, and despite there being plenty of material to analyze, were only found bones of dogs and cats. Child or track, "he adds.

True Lies, the work that Gonçalo Amaral wrote recounting his version of theMaddie case, after being away from investigations, is allegedly on the basis of the difficult financial situation in which the former inspector currently sits.

In the book, Gonçalo Amaral argues that "minor Madeleine McCann died in the apartment in the Ocean Club, in Vila da Luz, on the night of May 3, 2007; was a simulation of abduction; Kate Healy and Gerald McCann are suspected of involvement in the concealment of the corpse of the daughter; death may have befallen a result of a tragic accident; there is evidence of negligence in the custody and safety of children. We are conscious of having given our best to solve the case. Our beliefs are based on professional experience, on facts and evidence collected and their interpretation in the light of the law. "

Statements that led the child's parents to sue former inspector, pawning him all goods and pushing it to the economic situation that is nowadays. The book would be withdrawn from the market in 2009, in compliance with a court order resulting from a proceeding brought by the parents of Madeleine McCann. The British couple pawned all bank accounts, movable and immovable property of the researcher, who was living with only the salary reform, he also later pawned in part by the couple.

With the cuts in salary and expenses resulting from treatments that failing health compels him to do, Gonçalo Amaral, the PJ assured sources, is in penury: "He only survives thanks to the solidarity of colleagues and family."

Anonymous said...


@8.05 PM.

Its a disgrace what has been waged against Goncalo Amaral.....My honest opinion is that most people would have not lived through the stress, to my mind its a form of attempted murder - what is been done to Goncalo Amaral for defending the truth.

If the WOC and implications were correctly carried out in LAW which I hoped the court would have done - but has chosen not to.

Then the withheld money from the book would need to be recalculated and returned !

He is been stitched up ...his own country which he loves have decided that the money of the UK is what they prefer over the truth.

I don't hold out any hope, the so called establishments that the people rely on as the backbone to their lives are been operated by criminals (UK&Portugal) with a huge agenda....Goncalo is considered collateral damage to the "bigger" picture....He is expendable to their greater scheme.

Mojo

Anonymous said...


The UK presumption of death act was planned to be come effective in law from April 1st 2014

It has been delayed until 1st October.

Just after Goncalo Amarals trial.

Anonymous said...

I thought the act was already effective?

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2013/13/notes/contents

Various Portuguese TV channels (and I think Amaral himself) have made reference to the declaration.

Reading through it (as best I can) there is reference to a right to appeal on specific cases. I wonder if someone is currently tryi

Anonymous said...

@6.25 AM

the act was written 2013 and was supposed to come into effect on the 1st April 2014....it has been delayed until 1st October 2014.

just after the trial!

so the situation is thus.

1. WOC not validated
2. presumption of death act ..on hold
3. Goncalo Amaral at present denied the right to give a statement.
4.No jury - only a judge
5. no cross examination allowed directly of the McCann's.

Mojo

Anonymous said...

Thanks for clarifying mojo, yep, just found a link, you're right...October it is!
What a tangled web.

Anonymous said...

What is happening to Amaral is nothing short of a vendetta against a man whose "crime" is to give his opinion that the parents were somehow involved in Madeleine's disappearance.
He has no money but is being hounded to the end by people with (IMO) no moral compass.
Their only raison d'etre seems to be to sue anyone who 'dares' disagree with their version of events on May 3rd all those years ago. One might consider that they would be better staying home with the children they still have.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous@ 6.31

These are very good points.



No, she was named because the parents are trying to create the impression that they represent her with respect to the spurious notion of "everybody has the human right to be searched for" (says Gerry). But of course that is a heap of bollocks. The only searches that are privileged *in law* are those conducted by the authorities. Hampering a police search is indeed a criminal offence (as the McCanns know very well).; and even if this were not the case, even if 'the search' for Madeleine was privileged in law, the McCanns would have no more right to represent Madeleine in that instance as they would in any other....ie NONE..she is a WOC!!

I do think that without the Family Courts permission Madeliene's name could not be attached to the Libel petiton and the Portuguese Judge is asking whether permission has been given from Lord Justice Hogg and her Court?

Also: you aree spot on for my money with this:

The only searches that are privileged *in law* are those conducted by the authorities.

In the media and even on some forums there is a disconnect as to who has the right to do what and where. The disappearance occurred in Portugal. The crime was carried out in Portugal and any trial will be carried out in Portugal if evidence emerges of course. If evidence emerges in the UK the PJ would have to be on hand during questioning and would have the right to ask for any forensics found and any other admissable evidence to be handed over to them. That as far as I know is European Law.

Presumption of death act!

This is a curious Law anyway because yet again 7 years is a UK Law and not a Portuguese one. If for instance you were to make a claim for insurance purposes the
Country where the death happened would have to issue a notice to the UK Coroners Office I imagine so if there is no proof of Madeleine being presumed dead no Certificate can be issued until proven otherwise and backed up by the appropriate State Authorities.

This is the strangest state of affairs in this weird tale. The PJ ( latest) think Madeleiene is probably dead and SY thinks she might be or maybe not. The PJ seem to be looking for a single abductor/murderer ( possibly a one off and the person is back in the UK)? and SY are looking for some suspects for an alleged crime wherein SY have not made their mind up as to which crime they are suspected of!
That crime is at one point an abduction Madeleine is still alive ) OR she is not and has benn killed.

No wonder the media don't know what to say.

Make it up as we go along they will be asking SY.

Answer: Yes just do what we are doing.

What a mess.

Good post though.


Anonymous said...

@ 6.23pm

Presumption of death act!

Madeleine was a citizen of the UK.

If there is no proof of a UK Citizen been alive after 7 years then when this law gets passed - a death certificate can be applied for in UK LAW.

The law in my opinion has been put back/ delayed to prevent Goncalo Amarals legal team applying for the certificate.


There has been no proof of a "living" child and as your post says - Both police forces are looking at the "DEATH" scenario with FOCUS.

Unless SY are going to say that the GEO radar, dogs, spades, of the latest search are looking for underground bunkers where she may be living with her "new" family then one could say that they are looking for a "presumed" dead child.

Why?
Because over the last 7 years no evidence has turned up of a "living" one.

It is fair to say that they "PRESUME" she may be dead ?

That certificate would be a huge help to Goncalo Amarals legal team.

So The UK Government have delayed the passing in law...lets get real here.

What does it matter of any of the other struggling UK families out there, who require that the law gets passed so they can move on with their lives.

Those Family's will have to wait until the McCann's get everything they want first.

IT STINKS

If people can not see what's going on they are not looking.

IT IS CORRUPT BEYOND WORDS

mojo

Anonymous said...

This page gives an excellent summary of the current situation of 'declared death' and how the new act plans to change the process. (Presuming it's accuracy)

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Declared_death_in_absentia#England_and_Wales

The new act looks rather less critical than might be thought. The standard timescale remains at seven years for presumption, and even now (prior to the new act) there remains a right to appeal.

In May of this year there were one or two press articles in which Kate McCann spoke about perhaps having to accept Madeleine's death. There was some speculation at the time (if I remember rightly) that this was in concert with the SY 'searches' and maybe signalled a compromised 'closure'.

It seems more likely to me that it signalled a legal wrangle in which the McCanns were being faced with this 7 year presumption of death. These were preemptive press releases that hinted at something behind the scenes.

The tone has subsequently changed and now we go back to Gerry's usual incantation of 'no evidence of harm'...'alive and searched for' etc.

*We also know that the McCanns (without offering any explanation) have recently tried to delay the libel process until September.*

My speculation is that they are trying to legally contest the 7 year presumption of death here in the UK; and that they attempted to stall the libel hearing in the hope of that result being favourable.

Anonymous said...


Here are some simple straight forward questions that most the public would ask.

1.How long has Madeleine been missing ?

2. Has any evidence been found in that time that confirmed she is alive ?

3. What would any reasonable expert conclude from the Police files and circumstantial evidence?

4. What do statistics show for similar cases?

My speculation is that their is corrupt political manoeuvrings taking place.

We also know the judge straight after the searches found nothing... re opened the trial and set to have it concluded before OCT 1st.

If she waited she could have confirmed the WOC and whether the trial could proceed, she could have also allowed the presumption of death act to be finalised.

It would have made so much sense to do that rather than risk a mis trial and lets be honest why would a few extra weeks hurt - they have kept Goncalo living on the breadline for 7 years over this case.

Its a stich up folks ....but you will all find out later this year.

We can debate the ins and outs and in-betweens all day.
It doesn't change the BS of what's happening.

Its just so wrong ...its disturbing.

Thank you for the link - informative.


Mojo

Anonymous said...

@ There is alot about kates book that has took on a disturbing force of its own, beyond being narssacistic, if madeleine is persumed alive, then why hasnt kate made a order on the grounds she might of read amarals book?
Or read internet comments?
This has never been the case from the parents, so kate is only talking about people that are alive the twins, but no concerns if madeleine reads anything?

Anonymous said...

@6.47am

maybe because

1. Madeleine is WOC which means they have NO authority to do anything legal on her behalf....it would be interesting to know what the WOC though about Kate's book ?

2. Presumed alive ? I guess that reverses things - right so what evidence found over the last 7 years confirms that presumption ?

Mojo

Anonymous said...

A little off topic but I just was on the Mccanns site to see if they posted anything about the latest trial mess. And came across something interesting.

The page that has some suspects.... does not include the smith sighting.

This just adds to the fact that they never have tried to talk to the Smiths.... Being the people that likly last saw your kidnapped kid... you woudl think they would never leave them alone...

But then the page you list suspects.. They are interestingly enough NOT there.




http://www.findmadeleine.com/campaigns/unidentified_people.html

Anonymous said...

In my humble opinion the relation to
declaring a death is that you cannot libel/defame a person who is no longer alive.

Therefore in the case in Portugal
you could not file a claim for a deceased person and admit that death had occurred since filing.



Anonymous said...




In Portugal, locals have been spray painting “English police are stupid” around town. Its true. I just hope the judge in the libel trial stands by the last judgement and does not allow the Mccanns to win!


Anonymous said...


@12.55

we must remember that what is happening is not STUPID ....that would imply a form of genuine ..albeit incompetent investigation.

NO.............

what is happening is far more sinister.

It is a DELIBERATE PREMEDITATED ATTACK on a another country's police and work they carried out.

It Is a DELIBERATE strategy to ensure that the GUILTY go free as instructed by their POLITICAL masters.

What makes it even more Sinister is that Portugals public like the UK public can see through the charade but can do nothing about it (presently).

WHY....simple.....because..

Portugal and the UK establishments are equally working together on the cover up.

mojo

Anonymous said...

Anonymous at 6.47
I read Kate McCann's book "Madeleine" and found it telling that the title of the book bears little resemblance to the content It's more about the parents than Madeleine herself and shows no remorse or regret for their actions.
Selfish and egocentric is my opinion.

Anonymous said...

@6.47

its always been about them and never Madeleine.

Take this latest no legs legal trial against Goncalo Amaral, It has been ESTABLISHED in LAW that they cannot represent her in court due to the WOC.

This means they are suing Goncalo for damages for THEMSELVES using the FUND money raised for Madeleine.

The case is not even legal and never was when it began ..FACT

mojo

Anonymous said...

@ Can amaral make a request for the maCcanns to undergo a lie detector test, where this wasnt undertaken by their pr team?
Or is this not allowed under portugal law?

Anonymous said...

Anonymous@2.31

Yes off topic but very curious re: SY's ' search ' area.

The British Crimewatch programme flagged up the JT bundleman to a great fanfare. A " revelation" according to Andy Redwood.

There was an Irish Crimewatch style programme planned which came to nought. It never happened.

The Smith family are from Ireland and were mentioned in the media but have not been mentioned since.

The SY search areas are not that close to where the Smith family saw a man and child as far as I know and they ( The Smiths ) thought this person was headed towards the beach.

SY are studiously avoiding the Smiths I think.

Why- as this could be another
" revelation " moment if they find this man and child - particularly if it is not Mr McCann.

Re: WOC yet again.

Examine the McCann files article on this and note the date referring to 06 ( not 07 or 08.

Like The Fridge blog but more definite I remember seeing the actual Court Record and there was a great debate as to whether the 06 reference was a reference to the other Family Division Dates that day.

Intriguing.

Anonymous said...

@ Whats more interesting, its family members giving evidence, yet none witnessed any abduction to back up any libel claim, their statements are still in contradiction, not tested in a criminal court under oath, and by jury?
It maybe true there wasnt enough evidence to convict them?
But what about neglect and contradictions that hasnt been brought by the social services in their childs disapearence?
There is a serious risk over why this wasnt reviewd by them at all if redwood is looking for a dead child?
Also leaving two other children alone after a alleged abduction had taken place in kates alarm?
It is ironic they can claim damages in a neglect case?
And by requesting a lie detector test on all them statements made in contradiction should be applied, to secure what is libel, and what isnt, maCcann team failed in the fact there is no evidence of any abduction, so it simply would of made a good reason to request such tests, before attempting to ban any book?
And to find the alleged damages genuine?
Courts carnt rely on pr spin in any case, its corrupt and contempt under a fair trial, where information isnt cross examined previously to be authentic, or gone without scrutiny, for a valid claim?
The same applies in insurance claims, to check for fraud?
Before any money is paid out.
Just a opinion on them that have made contradictive statements.

Anonymous said...

It's always been all about them. Not Madeleine.
Money won't bring her back or heal the damage done by them leaving her alone in the first place.
How do they sleep at night knowing that no matter how often they deny the lack of attention to their children that they ARE responsible for her not being here?

Anonymous said...

@7.25 am

All excellent relevant points you raise.
it does infact get even more farcical with certain witnesses trying to give an impression they are qualified in fields they are not, all to try and add weight.

What we are witnessing is a case that will become historic for all the wrong reasons - I know one thing... I hope everybody involved in this case have considered their roles seriously - one way or another eventually the truth will out - it will not be allowed to be kept hidden.....it is then that other peoples parts will be scrutinized.

The historic timeline of events is logged and there will be no way to whitewash that, the judge will know this....one hopes.

It will be a case that leaves many looking over their shoulders for the rest of their lives........the truth is the only way.

mojo